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		| keith 
 
 
 Joined: 19 Sep 2005
 Posts: 3355
 Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 12:49 pm    Post subject: DB Saturday Puzzle:  July 14, 2007   (Corrected!!) |   |  
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				| Puzzle: DB071407             
 Keith
 
 
  	  | Code: |  	  | Puzzle: DB071407 ****** +-------+-------+-------+
 | . . . | 8 . . | 7 . . |
 | 8 5 . | . . 3 | . 9 6 |
 | 2 . . | . . . | . 8 . |
 +-------+-------+-------+
 | . . . | . . 9 | 2 . 3 |
 | . . 1 | . . . | 5 . . |
 | 4 . 2 | 6 . . | . . . |
 +-------+-------+-------+
 | . 6 . | . . . | . . 2 |
 | 5 1 . | 2 . . | . 7 9 |
 | . . 8 | . . 5 | . . . |
 +-------+-------+-------+
 
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		| Asellus 
 
 
 Joined: 05 Jun 2007
 Posts: 865
 Location: Sonoma County, CA, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:32 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				| Only needed one commonly used technique. 
 Are you sure you didn't correct it too much?
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		| keith 
 
 
 Joined: 19 Sep 2005
 Posts: 3355
 Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:48 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				| This is where basic methods run out of steam: 
  	  | Code: |  	  | +----------------+----------------+----------------+ | 1    49   3    | 8    69   46   | 7    2    5    |
 | 8    5    7    | 14   2    3    | 14   9    6    |
 | 2    49   6    | 5    179  147  | 3    8    14   |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
 | 6    78   5    | 17   178  9    | 2    4    3    |
 | 9    78   1    | 3    4    2    | 5    6    78   |
 | 4    3    2    | 6    5    78   | 9    1    78   |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
 | 3    6    9    | 147  178  1478 | 18   5    2    |
 | 5    1    4    | 2    3    68   | 68   7    9    |
 | 7    2    8    | 9    16   5    | 146  3    14   |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
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 I was able to solve R9C5 by multi-coloring, and then an XYZ-wing finished it off.
 
 Keith
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		| jLo 
 
 
 Joined: 30 Apr 2007
 Posts: 55
 
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:00 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				|  	  | keith wrote: |  	  | 
 I was able to solve R9C5 by multi-coloring, and then an XYZ-wing finished it off.
 
 Keith
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 A Skyscraper solves R9C5 as well, but singles is all that is required the rest of the way.
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		| keith 
 
 
 Joined: 19 Sep 2005
 Posts: 3355
 Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:20 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				|  	  | jLo wrote: |  	  | A Skyscraper solves R9C5 as well ...
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 Can you point it out?
 
 
  	  | jLo wrote: |  	  | ... but singles is all that is required the rest of the way.
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 You are correct!
 
 Keith
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		| Marty R. 
 
 
 Joined: 12 Feb 2006
 Posts: 5770
 Location: Rochester, NY, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:29 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				| From Keith's position, I also used the skyscraper to finish it off. |  | 
	
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		| jLo 
 
 
 Joined: 30 Apr 2007
 Posts: 55
 
 
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				|  Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:55 pm    Post subject: |   |  
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				|  	  | keith wrote: |  	  | Can you point it out?
 
 
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 <1>s at R3C6, R3C9, R7C6, R9C9  - eliminations at R9C5 and R7C7.
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		| jLo 
 
 
 Joined: 30 Apr 2007
 Posts: 55
 
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 12:42 am    Post subject: |   |  
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				|  	  | Asellus wrote: |  	  | 
 Are you sure you didn't correct it too much?
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 If you had seen the original post, you would have seen that it
 was much much easier.
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		| Earl 
 
 
 Joined: 30 May 2007
 Posts: 677
 Location: Victoria, KS
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 2:17 am    Post subject: DB July 14 |   |  
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				| Keith's posted grid has <179> at R3C5. Would it not be required to eliminate the <1> in R3C5 to have a valid skyscraper?
 
 Perhaps I need to learn more about skyscrapers.
 
 Earl
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		| jLo 
 
 
 Joined: 30 Apr 2007
 Posts: 55
 
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 4:03 am    Post subject: Re: DB July 14 |   |  
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				|  	  | Earl wrote: |  	  | Keith's posted grid has <179> at R3C5. Would it not be required to eliminate the <1> in R3C5 to have a valid skyscraper?
 
 
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 The skyscraper is down columns 6 and 9.
 
 Two <1>s in column 6.  Two <1>s in column 9.  Row 3 is shared by both.
 Eliminate the <1>s from the shared buddies of the cells that don't
 share a row.
 
 If the <1> in row three is at R3C5, then both R7C6 and R9C9 are <1>s
 and the elimination is still valid.
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		| keith 
 
 
 Joined: 19 Sep 2005
 Posts: 3355
 Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 4:46 am    Post subject: |   |  
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				| Here is what I used: 
  	  | Code: |  	  | +----------------+----------------+----------------+ | 1    49   3    | 8    69   46   | 7    2    5    |
 | 8    5    7    | 14b  2    3    | 14B  9    6    |
 | 2    49   6    | 5    179  147  | 3    8    14b  |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
 | 6    78   5    | 17a  178A 9    | 2    4    3    |
 | 9    78   1    | 3    4    2    | 5    6    78   |
 | 4    3    2    | 6    5    78   | 9    1    78   |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
 | 3    6    9    | 147  178  1478 | 18   5    2    |
 | 5    1    4    | 2    3    68   | 68   7    9    |
 | 7    2    8    | 9    16C  5    | 146  3    14B  |
 +----------------+----------------+----------------+
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 In C4, a and/or b are not <1>.  Following the strong links, A and/or B is <1>.  Therefore C is not <1>.
 
 This is the same logic as a skyscraper, except one "tower" is longer than one strong link.
 
 Keith
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		| Earl 
 
 
 Joined: 30 May 2007
 Posts: 677
 Location: Victoria, KS
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 11:46 am    Post subject: DB July 15 |   |  
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				| Is Keith's logic "multiple coloring." .i.e. two coloring series connected?
 
 Earl
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		| keith 
 
 
 Joined: 19 Sep 2005
 Posts: 3355
 Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 9:16 pm    Post subject: Re: DB July 15 |   |  
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				|  	  | Earl wrote: |  	  | Is Keith's logic "multiple coloring." .i.e. two coloring series connected?
 
 Earl
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 Yes.
 
 Keith
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		| Asellus 
 
 
 Joined: 05 Jun 2007
 Posts: 865
 Location: Sonoma County, CA, USA
 
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				|  Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 4:11 am    Post subject: |   |  
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				| It's also known as a "Color Wing" with ab as the "Bridge" between the two "Color Wraps."  (It is important to note that eliminations can only occur from the polarity opposite that of the bridge; A and B in this case.) 
 I'm still on the lookout for a Color Wing that uses a W-Wing as the Bridge.  Haven't found one yet.  Maybe someone will beat me to it?
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		| ravel 
 
 
 Joined: 21 Apr 2006
 Posts: 536
 
 
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				|  Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 7:48 am    Post subject: |   |  
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				| I was not familiar with "Color Wings". The 3 samples i saw here, can also be solved with "3 strong links" (like you have "2 strong links" in a skyscraper or kite). From my experience with 2 or 3 strong links you can make more than 90% of the eliminations, that are possible with multiple coloring. I only saw a few samples, where you would need "grouped strong links".
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